The Cherie quilt that I’m working on at the moment is made up of traditional quilt blocks. The overall layout of the blocks is one that I’ve come up with myself, but each individual block is a traditional block that I’ve found online.
The blocks I’m making are 6”, 9” and 12”, so what I’m doing is finding an image, usually in one of the traditional block libraries or a traditional magazine online, and then working out the assembly techniques and measurements I need for myself.
These are the ones I’ve made so far:
In there, there’s:
1. A 12” Christmas star
2. A 12” Dutchman’s puzzle
3. A 12” Martha Washington’s star
4. A 12” Moonlight serenade
5. A 12” Weathervane
6. A 9” Perpetual motion
7. A 9” Ohio star
8. A 9” Double pinwheel
9. A 9” Calico puzzle
10. A 9” Pineapple blossom
11. A 9” Sweet dreams and sunbeams
Now one of the sites I found had an interesting disclaimer on it, ‘You may not try and use this block in anything you sell, I own copyright’ or words to that effect. I didn’t look any further, but these were traditional blocks, such as churn dashes, Dutchman’s puzzles and more, so I began to ponder… Now typically, the duration of copyright is the whole life of the creator plus fifty to a hundred years from the creator’s death, or a ‘finite period’ for anonymous or corporate creations. Given how long people have been at this quilting lark, and how long these traditional blocks have been around for, I’m pretty sure the original copyright holder, if one could be identified, has been long since pushing up the daisies!
So what do you think? Can anyone come along, write up instructions for a single block, whack it up online and claim copyright on the block? Personally I think the person wouldn’t have a leg to stand on unless they’d invented some amazing new technique to create the thing because let’s face it, there are only so many ways you can make the 4 HSTs, 8 rectangles and a square needed for a churn dash block for example – I have visions of this woman running around frantically all over the internet, finding churn dash blocks in quilt patterns for sale and trying to claim copyright.
Where it gets interesting is when it gets to the entire pattern for a quilt. Now if you use a traditional block as your base, where it starts wandering into the realms where you could claim copyright is when you start including things such as sashing, borders, flanges, prairie points, embroidery, or anything else you can think of to enhance the finished quilt. I’m still pretty sure there’s a fair number of unintentional copies of the same pattern out there between books, magazines, big box and indie pattern writers, I mean there’s bound to have been more than one person that’s come up with, say, a 3 x 4 churn dash block layout using 12” blocks with 2” sashing and 3 contrasting borders, each 4” wide. And if there isn’t, that’s one’s mine, okay? ;o)
So what are your thoughts? Do you think people should be trying to claim copyright of patterns incorporating traditional blocks? I think in the example above it’s fine, but I’m not sure if I’d bother chasing after someone else with the same idea as mine to try and stake my claim definitively, plus, since copyright is automatic within all countries under the Berne Convention, it would technically be the first person to come up with that layout that would own the copyright, and I’m not sure how you would ever trawl through all the pre-digital inventions to prove that Annie Smith over in her farm in Idaho got there before me. When it starts coming to clearly unique layouts and arrangements however, such as Jen Kingwell’s Gypsy Wife, I think I’d be out there in a flash!
Answers on a postcard…
I did a bit of research on this when I was writing my first paid quilt pattern. I wish I'd kept links to my sources but the laws protect the pattern not the product. I can copyright the pattern I wrote, specifically the set of instructions, graphics and copy used, and hold a copyright to that but I cannot copyright on the end product.
And when it comes to traditional blocks you absolutely cannot claim a copyright on the design but you can claim copyright to the set of instructions you put together to demonstrate how to make the product. I'm not a lawyer so this should not be taken as legal advice but this is my understanding after having dome some research on it in the past. I spent some time looking into copyrights for patterns based on traditional designs cause the pattern I was working on was a split Irish chain. That's a very common traditional pattern and I don't claim to have designed an original layout; the value of the pattern was in the instructions on how to produce the end product.
I think a lot of it comes down to people being ignorant about their legal rights. I don't mean that in a disrespectful way they just don't know because they are uneducated on the subject. That's okay, I'm uneducated on a lot of things too! It's akin to the copyright notice people post on their Facebook walls that they think protects their rights. That's just not how it works so I can claim copyright on this comment but will it stand up in court? Probably not.
13 spools had an interesting post on this recently http://www.13spools.com/2014/12/can-copyright-quilt.html
First, different countries have different laws on copyright.
Second, copyright is only going to protect you if you are willing to hire a lawyer and bring a lawsuit. This is generally out of quilters' budgets.
Third, what you own is your own creative input. Generally that is the instructions you write and share to make the block and/or the pattern. Perhaps the layout and the colour choices for a particular single quilt might qualify but that is more dicy. One cannot own geometry. All these designs have been done before, by quilters, artists, tilesetters, mother nature, etc. back to the dawn of time. This is the law of the commonwealth countries and the US as I understand it, as a lawyer and all.
I'm with Terri Ann! 😀
Amy Garro of 13 Spools had some interesting posts earlier this month in regard to copyright and quilt blocks, patterns, etc… If I am interpreting her research correctly if someone posts a tutorial or pattern using a traditional block but new techniques for construction, the new technique can be covered by copyright but not the block design itself because that is public domain.
Lordy!!
Interesting, but you said flange, so I lost my serious train of thought x
Hahaha Hadley!!! I agree with what you've said and that it's the construction not the final product that people can claim as their idea but regardless I love your blocks!!! The pineapple blossom block is stunning! I want to do a whole quilt of those one day!
you cant copyright a block, thats nonsense. the layout of your quilt and the instructions how to put it together are a bit greyer. cherie is looking good though!
Just remember there's a lot of crap online and just because someone says it, doesn't mean it's true! People drive me nuts with their patterns, for instance. I cannot photocopy your pattern and then sell it. But I can sell the actual pattern, or give it away. And then there are the people who claim you can't sell anything you make from the pattern. That's not true! You cannot control the end product of a pattern. I do not even have to tell people I used your pattern to make my product. But you cannot copyright a quilt block that has been in the public domain. Plus, I wonder if these copyright-crazed people realize that they have to actually pay to copyright their patterns by registering them at the copyright office before they have any legal chance of success in a lawsuit.
I've done quite alot of copyright research for the USA, and Terri Ann is completely right. So as of now, I have copyright on the written instructions for my oh-so-fabulous technique for producing completely reversible widgets. But I have to apply for a patent for the design of my artwork or pattern. When I finally produce my incredible space bending design wall, I will patent the design and drawings, and copyright the instructions. I wonder if the blogger was protecting her blog content from being published in online mags without her consent, or if she was actually attempting to lay claim to the pattern for a traditional block… either way, it's a no go for her.
I was thinking about this a little the other day. I've made enough quilts now for my home and all the babies I know. If I want to continue making quilts then it's logical that I sell a few. I used a Moda Bakeshop recipie the other day but I wasn't sure if I could the sell the quilt as it wasn't my pattern. I used different fabric but everything was as per the pattern. I may end up with a quilt on every surface in my house if my friends don't start having more kids.
As Marianne above said, as long as you're not trying to sell the actual pattern, there's not a restriction on selling the outcome of it.
I know nothing about this (except that being able to copyright a block, rather than the construction technique/written pattern, seems nonsensical) but it's an interesting read – thank you!
Don't some people get themselves tied up in knots on this topic! In another life I dealt with plagiarism in student work and it was interesting to see how the creative arts people had a very different take on this to other departments in their Universities. They were very comfortable with students taking an original piece of work and putting their own slant on it, and in many cases expected them to do this, without any hint of plagiarism being accused. Slavish copying of a work with no element of interpretation was, however, absolutely frowned upon. It is ludicrous to claim copyright on a design that has existed, and can be proven to have existed for several years before the publication of a pattern. I can see, though, how you might be able to claim ownership of your pattern instructions or the development of a new construction technique, anything else is madness!
There are a number of interesting TED talks on the issue of copyright, particularly in the fashion industry, where there is little or no protection for designs and the industry thrives. As Celtic Thistle said, copying is a time-honored tradition in the creative arts, and it was certainly the traditional way that people learned quilting. With most quilts, a simple look can tell you how to make the blocks, though there are certainly some techniques I would love to have help mastering and many quilts that amaze me. For some reason the idea of copyright rules supreme rather than that of sharing knowledge, and it leads to some ridiculousness. Companies have even tried to patent human genes.
i always wonder why people are not worried that if they don't transfer there knowledge to future generations all those beautiful skills will be lost; everyone makes a big fuss of teaching younger people how to knit, crochet or sew; i could post a question online and won't get an explanation for weeks or never. i understand it took some people quite a long time to learn the techniques they did but what good is it going to do them after they die???
Great discussion Katy , good on you for bringing it up. I don't know much, or anything about copyright so this is great info. I have thought it weird that people can get possesive over a block that has been around for eternity.
I can't see how anyone can claim to own the copyright to traditional designs. I even wonder about some other sewing patterns. The times I've seen a pattern for sale by more than one person for some kind of pouch claiming it's an original design. A while back a lovely online friend sent me something and after I'd blogged about it she messaged me and asked me not to blog about the gift with pictures because she was hoping to get the pattern published in a book. It was hard telling her her great idea had been done years previously on a different continent and I already owned a very similar item – so when I'd blogged about it never occurred to me it was something I needed to keep secret.
I have to confess, I have a similar disclaimer on my own blog ( copied from others I saw online) but my main purpose was as a CYA for anything I put up which was an original design. And the blog is a way to document that I was indeed the person who first created it. In case something was stolen. But in one sense, I understand that nothing on the internet is private, and that we, as a community of makers, need to build in each other's inspiration.
Like I've said all along, there is nothing new in quilting. Just interpretation. You said it right when you said you can't reinvent geometry. But I guess what we are paying for in a pattern is the quilt math, how much fabric we need , etc. I'm of the mindset if I want yo make it I will. I'm not out yo make money from quilting.
Don't you have to do the research and prove no one else did it before? And register your unique idea sonewhere? (Maybe that's for a patent) if someone tried to sue for copyright infringement it would probably be quite easy to find evidence of the same combination of shapes that predates their copyright claim!
Method, *maybe* but result, surely not
PS- your blocks look fab, and the colour combo is perfect!
Irritated of Marrakech!! I cant abide all this claiming traditional patterns as one's own just because they put up a tute as to how to make it!
p.s your blocks are beautiful 🙂
Laughing at Annabella, and totally agreeing with her too.
Good replies to this post so far…. I tend to sell my patterns to magazines but if they're traditional blocks (e.g. my pixel style supersize churn dash) they will still accept them. The copyright thing doesn't really cross my mind. If someone resold my words to another magazine though I'd be a bit narked. Many years ago I complained to a magazine that one of the customers to my resin jewellery shop had rewritten one of my tutorials from my book and resold it to them. They basically told me to do one, and looking into it with older eyes it's fair enough as they technique couldn't be copyrighted anyway and the writing was different. And I lost a customer as a result of mouthing off.
Always on my mind when I publish a pattern or tutorial!
I loved reading this and all the replys, I always think about if I buy a book and make a couple of items I can then lend, resell or pass on the book. But if the pattern was downloaded I feel I'm in the wrong if I then pass it on to a friend!